T506CSB up for auction, but...

[goldtop]

... isn't this the one that was Cat C a couple of years ago? Rebuild project was somewhere on the forum, I think?

If Silverstone Auctioneers are right that this was the only IOP manual in 1999, then it must be the same car. Mistyped reg in title, should be: T506CSB


Edit to add link: https://www.silverstoneauctions.com/honda-nsx-6964

(https://www.silverstoneauctions.com/honda-nsx-6964)

[lotusolly]

Not sure if its just the pics but the dash looks horribly shiny. If they have put some kind of polish on it, it would reflect horrendously in the screen.

[britlude]

so its with T99 NSX plate at auction, not the T506CSB.....

and is there only a dozen uk 3.2 6 speeds about?????? hmmm

[Mistercorn]

so its with T99 NSX plate at auction, not the T506CSB.....

and is there only a dozen uk 3.2 6 speeds about?????? hmmm

I wouldn't be suprised if there were a dozen 3.2l coupe pre-facelift models.

MC

[L696ULO]

That's Danny Boy's old car which was AR's previously

if if the link below works then page 7 shows the end result with the same number plate. If the link doesn't work it's the last thread in the NSX builds


http://www.nsxcb.co.uk/showthread.php?9917-99-NSX-re-commissioning-underway

[L696ULO]

I wouldn't be suprised if there were a dozen 3.2l coupe pre-facelift models.

MC

This thread is almost a year old now but it shows how many NSX the DVLA are around.

http://www.nsxcb.co.uk/showthread.php?12901-latest-from-howmanyleft-co-uk&highlight=Mot+table

Rich

[AR]

I wonder if some unfortunate person bought this car without due diligence, how they would feel once they knew the whole story!!!

Cat D twice, second time was bent pretty bad.

[Hagasan]

I wonder if some unfortunate person bought this car without due diligence, how they would feel once they knew the whole story!!!

Cat D twice, second time was bent pretty bad.

I think the last buyer did buy it knowing the history and took on a more in depth repair. It is he I think who is now selling it at the auction on the 6th of March?

[nobby]

surely that auction house based on the type of stuff they sell would do a history check on this car prior to advertising and looking top dollar for it?
Again, who would be foolish enough to part with a considerable sum of money WITHOUT doing their own checks ... for any car more to the point?!

[Pride]

so its with T99 NSX plate at auction, not the T506CSB.....

and is there only a dozen uk 3.2 6 speeds about?????? hmmm


In that case could it possibly be this car at the Silverstone auction, reg N5NSX ???
The plot thickens.

http://www.carscoops.com/2016/02/six-days-left-to-bid-for-delicious-2001.html

http://news.boldride.com/2016/02/acura-nsx-sports-car-auction-for-sale/99716/

http://www.topspeed.com/cars/car-news/2001-honda-nsx-set-for-auction-in-the-uk-ar172563.html

[nobby]

i see silverstone auctions have now revised their listing for the IOP car
I reckon there has been a few calls with regards to hpi checks being done!
it has been declared on sheet now as Cat D and the price has been reduced ...
Be interesting to see if it reaches anywhere near that price considering history ...

[goldtop]

Auction description now revised; mentions the Cat D thing, with a lower estimate.

[Shawnsx5]

Sorry but N5NSX is my newly imported 1996 NSX-R not the blue pre facelift NA2 car at Silverstone Auction- please clarify your point.

Neil


In that case could it possibly be this car at the Silverstone auction, reg N5NSX ???
The plot thickens.

http://www.carscoops.com/2016/02/six-days-left-to-bid-for-delicious-2001.html

http://news.boldride.com/2016/02/acura-nsx-sports-car-auction-for-sale/99716/

http://www.topspeed.com/cars/car-news/2001-honda-nsx-set-for-auction-in-the-uk-ar172563.html

[Pride]

Sorry but N5NSX is my newly imported 1996 NSX-R not the blue pre facelift NA2 car at Silverstone Auction- please clarify your point.

Neil

ooooops!!!! My mistake :)

I meant N5XLM, point clarified I hope.:D

[Shawnsx5]

and now to clarify my mistake - my NSX-R is N5 SXR not N5 NSX !!!!!!!!!!


ooooops!!!! My mistake :)

I meant N5XLM, point clarified I hope.:D

[Shawnsx5]

Watched the auction today.

The bids reached £30k so the car was unsold during the auction but may sell outside the auction process, the low estimate was £30k.

[marknsx]

Stripped down for parts what's it worth

[havoc]

Interesting thought...NA2 long block, gearbox etc. have got to be worth >>25% of the low estimate on their own. Body panels (if all new/straight) and glass would make up another 25% or more. Lights, minor motors, driveshafts, seats, cockpit interior etc. would a fair chunk more. Doubt it'd quite reach £30k though - 10 years ago a Cat-D NA1 was probably worth more in parts, not sure an NA2 ever has been.

[goldtop]

The problem with parting one out is that you have to take a very long view. Just too few around to generate a lot of demand for the parts. It'd take a very long time, a lot of space and a lot of grief to get the £30,000 back.

I thought about buying the Cat D red facelift (ERZ7272?) from a few years ago when it was about £22000. But decided not to for those reasons.

[AR]

On Ebay now and the damage is described as:

"NO EVIDENCE WHATSOEVER of the damage, which was entirely cosmetic. "

As P.T/ barnum used to say...

[Hagasan]

On Ebay now and the damage is described as:

"NO EVIDENCE WHATSOEVER of the damage, which was entirely cosmetic. "

As P.T/ barnum used to say...

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/HONDA-NSX-NA2-VERY-RARE-3-2-6-SPEED-VERY-LOW-MILES-53k-STUNNING-INVESTMENT-/322032201072?hash=item4afa9d6d70:g:AAkAAOSwr7ZW3hd M

Well the most recent feedback for the current seller might suggest why the above comments?? Although this wouldn't really be fair to the guy who made all attempts to be honest and open about the repair path he took...

[goldtop]

If the seller gave the full story/photos it might help allay any worries.

I bought a Cat D car (not an NSX) about 10 years ago. But I only did that because the seller showed plenty of photos of the damage. Two dented doors and some trim had been replaced following a low-speed accident. That's entirely reasonable and I was happy to go ahead; it really was cosmetic. When I sold it on, I also provided the same before/after repair photos.

Edited to add: Mods, can you correct the number plate in the thread title to 'T506CSB'?

[AR]

I believe i posted the photos before it wasa taken away by the recovery peple.

It was quote at an initial estimate of over £25K to repair it!

I don't class both front chassis legs and the drivers door having difficulty closing due to side of the car bowing cosmetic!

[T99nsx]

I own, have done for the past 2.5 years, and am selling the car in question.

AR, despite your vociferous outpouring on here, It would seem that you either don't know what you are talking about, or have some other 'sour grapes' position about the (MY) car. Do you still own an NSX?

The car has been thoroughly inspected, by a well regarded restoration shop, for all evidence of damage, or indeed any substandard repairs, and jigged to test alignment of all components.

Their verdict was, chassis is perfect. Repairs were isolated to replacement of front wings, bonnet, bumper and headlights, along with supporting components. There was ZERO evidence found of any deformation of any aspect of the vehicle.
Panel gaps are uniform throughout the car, and every aspect of the vehicle works perfectly.

The car is having an autolign inspection in the coming week, which will be noted in the register for independent (public) confirmation of the above.

As I assume you (AR) have not been party to, nor inspected either the subsequent repair or the follow on thorough recommissioning? Well, I say assume, but in truth I KNOW for certain, that you have not had the chance to look at the car, as I've spoken to the previous owner about you and your comments, and neither he, nor I, understand your basis for continuous 'bashing' of the car in question.

FACTS.

Your opinion of the damage, is totally different to the PROFESSIONALS who assessed the damage to the car. Hence, it was classified as a CATEGORY D!

CAT D - is SUPERFICIAL damage, deemed totally safe to repair and return to road use, without even needing ANY inspection, beyond a regular MOT.
This, IS FACT.
I own, another vehicle that received the exact same Category D status, that I purchased and repaired because it had key scratches! Category D means nothing of significance, except it was damaged, and the insurers chose to pay out the value of the vehicle rather than repair it. This doesn't mean the damage was serious, just that they decided it was easier and cheaper to do so, and to recover their costs through the sale of the vehicle.

If there was ANY question as to the structural integrity of the vehicle, it would have been a category C, and if the damage was truly 'dangerous' or significant, it may have been Category A or B. But it was NOT. It was category D. End.

It is very common for rare, imported, or exotic vehicles to end up as Category D, even with very minor damage, as insurance companies, do not wish to deal with prolonged hunt for parts, all the while paying out costs for hire cars etc for the IDIOT responsible.

[T99nsx]

I would also say, that I have 270+ positive feedback on eBay, and really cannot do anything about the fact that in 2011 I sold a 11 year old Mercedes, with 107k miles that suffered an engine failure a month later, because it had run out of oil, which was apparently due to a poor previous repair, where a sump gasket may not have been correctly fitted. I did not do the repair, and despite the feedback, I did in fact PAY for the engine of that car to be rebuilt! NET outcome, was that the repairs cost me MORE than I sold the car for! Unfortunately the individual did not change, nor did he have the decency to update the negative feedback he left on eBay.
I still have this negative feedback, but neither try to hide it on my sale of the NSX, nor do I in any way try to hide that the NSX has been repaired.
I am not a car dealer. I have sold 5 (of my personal) cars on eBay since 2006. I own around 20 cars, ranging from classic Porsches and Mercedes, to 30s - 70s hotrods and Americans - and an NSX.
I have owned 3 NSXs including my current Imola orange 3.2.
I've never crashed, ANY of them.

[T99nsx]

Anyone who has seen my car, will tell you, it is in beautiful condition, looks great, runs and drives great.
It has 50k miles, and has had, with proof, 2 cam belt changes, the last being less than 4K miles ago.
It is one of the VERY rare, 3.2 6 speed cars, with popup lights.
They are appreciating rapidly.
It of course will never be worth as much as a car which has never had recorded damage. BUT - how many of these Japanese import cars have been repaired??? Who knows. How many NSXs running around, have had accident damage which was repaired, without being recorded? Again, who knows!
Many of you, sadly - or happily remain in ignorant bliss, thanks to good quality repairs.

Mine is honest, and will stand up to any scrutiny. I will not twist anyone's arm to buy it, and would point out, that It's also, 20k less, than a near identical car, sold by silverstone auctions in late Feb this year.

So what if it had a repair, it's a bargain! Totally usable, awesome, brilliant car, which will only continue to increase in value.

I really do not give a hoot if it doesn't sell, it will continue to appreciate in value tucked away in my cosy garage. I will continue to enjoy driving it, when it comes out on sunny days. Or, someone else will buy it, and whoever the lucky individual is that buys it, will likely read your uninformed bile, and potentially develop a similar sense of contempt* and disdain* that I feel towards you AR.

I'm FURIOUS about your uninformed and malicious comments, and the high potential material impact you are having on the value of my property.
You can be sure, now that I know about the contents of this forum, that I will vigorously pursue having all such damaging comments removed from public record.

*ps. They are not the 'exact' words I would choose were this not a public forum.

[AR]

As I assume you (AR) have not been party to, nor inspected either the subsequent repair or the follow on thorough recommissioning? I don't understand your basis for continuous bashing of the car in question?

Your opinion of the damage, is totally different to the PROFESSIONALS who assessed the damage to the car. Hence, it was classified as a CATEGORY D!

CAT D - is SUPERFICIAL damage, deemed totally safe to repair and return to road use, without even needing ANY inspection, beyond a regular MOT.
This, IS FACT.

It is very common for rare, imported, or exotic vehicles to end up as Category D, even with very minor damage, as insurance companies, do not wish to deal with prolonged hunt for parts, all the while paying out costs for hire cars etc for the IDIOT responsible.


So I guess the guy who owned it and CAT D before me was an IDIOT, I am an IDIOT as I CAT D it for the second time and following your Logic so was Senna and every other person who had a crash!

Superficial Damage - I am still unsure why I did not call a Chips Away or Paintless dent specialist...It must be because I am such an IDIOT!

http://i63.tinypic.com/2gseoo6.jpg


Gotta love the eBay feedback comment on your profile:

"A complete crook!!! Sells clapped out cars with bodged engine repairs .. con man"

Quoting your words from the advert:

"the damage required to cause a CAT D claim was very minor."

Are you serious???

[T99nsx]

It might look dramatic.

But, the windscreen is intact - plastic bumper, bonnet, wings. As I stated.

That's what cat D means.

Come inspect the car.

Ps - were you on a race track? Or just driving like a c**k?

[T99nsx]

I'd love to know your qualifications to inspect or comment on the damage a car has sustained?

any?

Or, are you just a insecure small man, who spends day after day on a forum, spouting about things you know nothing about?

Theres the car. It's near as dammit perfect.

http://www.classicandsportscar.com/classifieds/lightbox?advertid=5263191&index=1&link=false

My number is on the ad on eBay. Give me a call, and come take a look, but I wouldn't let you drive it. For obvious reasons

[AR]

It looks like what it was, a non cosmetic crash.

The issue here is not my driving but your lack of factual information on the advert.

If you feel that confident then you will have no issues posting the above picture on your ad.

Did you or did you not tell people it was minor and cosmetic. The picture and estimate of cat D prove you wrong.

Your feedback on eBay, current posts here and tactically written ad on eBay say a lot about your character.

Accept it, the damage was not just cosmetic.

Either you did not know the extent of it or you knew.

Both are bad, as for the one shows lack of due diligence, as only a fool will buy such a car without researching its history and the other well...

A picture is worth a thousand words!!!

[T99nsx]

whatever you like to imagine, however ignorant you are, whatever carp you chose to say, do, fail to understand..
There are some facts.

Fact - the car was damaged, by your crappy driving

Fact - the damage was assessed as category D.

Fact - category D is cosmetic or minor damage,

Fact - category D is considered minor enough to NOT require inspection before returning to the road.

Fact - the assessor who categorised the vehicle is a professional at assessing damage

Fact - the car has been repaired, and is in great condition and is open to any inspection.

Fact - the car was on display to THOUSANDS at the NEC car show this year.

Fact - You are the one who was driving like an idiot on public roads, and comparing yourself to Senna?


And how dare you question my integrity! You know nothing about me, I have openly disclosed that the car has had damage in my ad. I have nothing to hide, and am not ashamed of anything in my ad, my posts on this forum, nor my past.

Enough is enough - my further comments on the matter will be via legal channels now.



I would request that the moderators delete this entire thread, and will follow up this request with a formal demand, as it contains comments in clear violation of forum rules.

[NZNick]

Ignoring the comments, I am amazed that this was categorised as superficial/minor/cosmetic.

Making any potential buyer aware of this photo is part of what NSXCB is about, IMHO.

If there are more photos to accompany the picture above, that would aid clarification.

[AR]

I will leave the deletion or moderation in the very capable hands of the NSXCB team.

As for YOUR accusations , allegations and insults, they say a lot more about YOU than I could ever articulate!

[havoc]

Good lord, did I leave the gas on?!? ;)

I think neither of you are entirely unbiased in this - the current owner (vendor) clearly has a vested interest in making the car as desirable as possible to potential buyers. Ary, you are the ex-owner with your own memories of the car and the damage/repairs to it, so your information is valuable to a potential buyer, but you're not a professional car-assessor. A picture DOES tell a thousand words though...

I do believe that Nick's comments above are spot-on too - the NSX community SHOULD be about looking-out for future owners and keeping some sort of record of the history of cars...it's what most classic-car communities do, to some degree.

So, whilst I DO agree that some of the bile and nonsense (from both sides) should be deleted, including some of the "Facts" spouted by T99, I don't believe the thread should be deleted...perhaps 'pruned a little'...



Fact - the damage was assessed as category D.

Fact - category D is cosmetic or minor damage,

Fact - category D is considered minor enough to NOT require inspection before returning to the road.

Fact - You are the one who was driving like an idiot on public roads, and comparing yourself to Senna?

I need also to pick up on this, as these are not facts, merely opinions touted as facts. I can categorically say that Cat-D IS NOT "cosmetic or minor damage" - legally, it's damage that is "uneconomic to repair", which from an insurance perspective typically means total costs (inc. assessor/other fees, loan-car costs and repairs) exceed their hurdle-rate (which is usually 50-70% of open market value, depending on car and underwriter). So if this car was worth e.g. £30k at the time of write-off, the repairs, loaner-cost and other fees would probably top £20k. It's up to a buyer to then work out how significant that repair would / wouldn't have been, and whether 'cosmetic' or not.
(In this instance I'll refrain from commenting - I can only see 1 photo, I don't have anywhere near all the facts)

The final comment above is clearly not a fact, unless I've missed Ary's confession - it's an ad-hominem attack. Which rather diminishes T99's positioning of himself as the victim here.

What WILL give a buyer a lot of confidence is a whole series of before/after photos and details of inspection and repair. If the vendor has this, then that's the sort of information that will put any argument over severity to bed VERY quickly. Just a suggestion...

Vendor - good luck with the sale, but please be open and honest - your eBay advert is rather light on detail and that can only lead to speculation, warranted or otherwise.
Ary - any buyer investigating on here will find your comments and if they wish to follow up I'm sure will contact you directly. It's probably wise if you refrain from further comments on this thread. If you have before/after pictures though, then you're welcome to post them up...they are clearly undisputable facts about the car and cannot be considered unfair/biased/lies.

(For reference, in case anyone thinks I've an axe to grind, I bought a repaired NSX - a previous owner binned it at the 'ring, requiring replacement rear bumber, n/s/r wing and tail-lights. Clearly not structural and you'd need to look very closely to spot anything now...and on a 100k car 'originality' is probably less important than on a 20k car)

[NSX 2000]

Good lord, did I leave the gas on?!? ;)



If you didn't leave the gas on who did :D

Come on own up, my money is on Papalazarou :)

[nobby]

The information should definitely STAY. As Martin eluded it could do with some trimming BUT perspective, serious buyers will read through information posted and make their own judgement call on the actual CAR.

My main concern initially about this car was when the car was advertised on the Silverstone Auction there a few weeks ago the original information posted by the Silverstone auction was not truthful; It did NOT detail damage history in original listing ... we all saw that. I actually at one point was going to enquire about the car and ask about history and then all of a sudden SA had quickly edited the original advert to display rather IMPORTANT information that was missing and the sale price radically reduced. IMHO this was a major mistake and not sure what was happening either by vendor or SA to allow this to happen at all. But then again anyone buying such a car would hopefully know to run an HPI check. IMHO this sequence of events alone would increase my fears of potentially buying and owning this vehicle EVEN though the vendor has stressed that professional work and appropriate feedback has been sought. It should be highlighted very quickly to any potential buyer that the car has been damaged repaired.

This forum/thread will be able to facilitate serious enquiries about the car and provides communication channels to prior owner (in this case Ary) about the car and who knows the damage extensively. At the end of the day the buyer will make the final judgement call based on how they see the car now and what damage was done in the past.

[lotusolly]

If you didn't leave the gas on who did :D

Come on own up, my money is on Papalazarou :)

PMSL, I was thinking exactly the same as I read this thread!

I do agree with Martin here and that FACTUAL information regarding the car should remain on the site.

I have purchased and repaired a cat D car before (Not my NSX) and if the repair is carried out properly, there should be no issues with the car.
Its also worth considering that a £35k repair on a £60K car could likely be carried out by the insurance and be untraceable but the same repair required on a £40K car would result in it being written off. If the car is repaired to the same standard what's the difference? The big question is usually what corners have been cut to make this a viable repair for one party when it wasn't for another. Carrying out the work yourself to save on labour or the use of second hand parts (which can still be newer than the originals) is usually the method followed, but if done properly still doesn't make it a bad repair. Official thorough inspection is always the key.
I also know of a brand new Citroen ZX which was crushed between the decks of a ship whilst being delivered. The roof was pushed down to the bottom of the windscreen and the car was supposed to have been scrapped but a miss communication resulted in the car being repaired and it appeared at a Citroen dealer as their demonstrator! I definetly wouldn't have wanted to buy that car but I doubt any of its owners ever knew!

I may be getting mixed up with another car and apologies to T99 if I am but I thought the previous owner posted a very detailed rebuild thread on this car as it's repair was not originally carried out well and he rebuilt it with what appeared to be great attention to detail?

If this is the same car then the detailed rebuild thread along with an appropriate inspection would not have made me dismiss a car for being cat D if priced appropriately, however the initial listing with Silverstone not declaring it, an advert making light of the original damage and a rant trying to hide its history certainly would!

Olly

[Problem Child]

The information should definitely STAY. As Martin eluded it could do with some trimming BUT perspective, serious buyers will read through information posted and make their own judgement call on the actual CAR.

My main concern initially about this car was when the car was advertised on the Silverstone Auction there a few weeks ago the original information posted by the Silverstone auction was not truthful; It did NOT detail damage history in original listing ... we all saw that. I actually at one point was going to enquire about the car and ask about history and then all of a sudden SA had quickly edited the original advert to display rather IMPORTANT information that was missing and the sale price radically reduced. IMHO this was a major mistake and not sure what was happening either by vendor or SA to allow this to happen at all. But then again anyone buying such a car would hopefully know to run an HPI check. IMHO this sequence of events alone would increase my fears of potentially buying and owning this vehicle EVEN though the vendor has stressed that professional work and appropriate feedback has been sought. It should be highlighted very quickly to any potential buyer that the car has been damaged repaired.

This forum/thread will be able to facilitate serious enquiries about the car and provides communication channels to prior owner (in this case Ary) about the car and who knows the damage extensively. At the end of the day the buyer will make the final judgement call based on how they see the car now and what damage was done in the past.

I do not want to enter into this very entertaining slanging match (such things should take place privately behind closed doors) but it does demonstrate that we all have a responsibility to be careful and accurate about what we say about our own cars, and each others cars. I for one would be extremely miffed if another forum member passed opinion on my car and that their comment in turn adversely affected its value when sold. I equally think there is a responsibility (both morally and legally) on sellers to describe their property accurately.
Whilst I received great advice from forum members when I bought my car, and I am eternally grateful for this I do think we all need to stick to the facts rather than opinions, especially since the financial impact on the value of a car could be quite considerable.
This case is a good example of why recording a history of each of our cars would be useful. Writing a page on the forum that details repairs, damage, maintenance, MOTs, upgrades etc would be a great resource for potential buyers whereas slanging matches such as the one above have potential financial implications and do not do the reputation and credibility of the NSX community any good

[NSXGB]

http://www.nsxcb.co.uk/showthread.php?9917-99-NSX-re-commissioning-underway

http://www.nsxcb.co.uk/showthread.php?10947-Alas-got-to-sell-my-NSX

[Senninha]

The history of this car is well documented within this forum with recent posts bringing them all into one thread.

Damage classification is readily available for any potential purchaser, as is vehicle history for a small fee to the appropriate motoring department by any potential purchaser.

For further information about this vehicle or any others advertised for sale NSXCB always advises buyers to contact previous owners by IM.

Thread closed.