VTEC at lower RPM ?

[Paul]

I've just spent the best part of £36 on a new chip (inc p & p), which is claimed to give an extra 10 to 14bhp ... with caveats that it works best with other mods ... so I'm not expecting the full quota of extra horses.

I appreciate that by changing the engine timing/mapping/fuel mixture etc you might be able to change the power output. However, the seller also claims the chip will have:
"VTEC: 4800"

New listing for same chip, with the same claims (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/A-SPOON-ECU-CHIP-PR7-honda-vtec-92-95-NSX-C-series-V6_W0QQitemZ320026654858QQihZ011QQcategoryZ32094QQ ssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem)

Now, imho, I can only read this as a blatant claim that when installed the engine will enter VTEC mode at the stated rpm.

However, I'm under the impression that the VTEC on an NSX is designed to kick in at around 6,000rpm ... give or take a few revs ... and that it does so due to oil pressure forcing a pin to engage the second 'high lift' cam.

So, I'm intrigued as to whether there is any substance in the seller’s claim of VTEC at 4,800rpm ... which I reckon to be around 1,000rpm lower than normal for an NSX.

I'm not worried if the VTEC engagement point is unchanged when the chip is installed, but I would like to set the seller straight if his claim is false. If I gain only a few horses from the chip I will be happy enough, after all, I wouldn't be surprised to find that a few have escaped from the engine bay, since it left the factory, having visited the rolling road at the end of the month to find out.

Can anyone shed any light on this :?:

If this claim is pie in the sky, I will send a message to the seller, via eBay if at all possible, that his claim is ... shall we say ... well, pie in the sky. If on the other hand the claim is quite plausible I will bide my time until I can get confirmation, one way or another, as to the validity of the claim for this chips capabilities.

[amo]

thought the vtec came in at 5k- 8k
imo id never use a chip that cheap in my nsx im lookin at hks pro or aem

if u can change the vtec will u not have to change all the set up as fuel/air as u will run too rich /lean =blown engine!!!!!

thx amo

[Paul]

thought the vtec came in at 5k- 8k Maybe I should have put 6,000rpm to the redline. Are you sure that the VTEC comes in at 5,000rpm then :?:


imo id never use a chip that cheap in my nsx im lookin at hks pro or aem What would be an approximate price on chip only cost from them for an approximate 10-14bhp gain :?:


if u can change the vtec will u not have to change all the set up as fuel/air as u will run too rich /lean =blown engine!!!!! I'm trying to find out if the VTEC can be changed by just a chip alone ... I think it would be a reasonable presumption that the chip would be set up to change all the required parameters.

If the VTEC can't be changed by chip alone, it will be interesting to find out how the BHP improvement has been made.

Didn't someone on here have some chips that gave some extra BHP a while back :?:

[darkblueturbo]

I'm new to NSX's, but I'm not new to ECu tuning...

From what I've seen of the Civic Type-R's the ECU does indeed control the point the VTEC kicks in - you can buy special ECu controllers to alter this, as with this allegedly Spoon chip.
However, I'm not sure how that works with the pin and oil pressure amo refers to...


But even if this is the case I have always shied away from a simple chip you can plug in that works wonders.
Again referring to amo, you would need the ignition and fuelling to be fully remapped to take full power advantage of the new VTEC point and stop the engine running lean at those early revs in the new VTEC range.

Aside from feeling a bit rough and 'coughing' on part throttle it would also lead to detenation in the combustion chamber, unltimately spelling the end of your engine.

My experience is with turbo charged motors which have the similar problem when you get these chips that up the boost level... They don't up the fuelling to match the higher boost and detenation ensues...

If you want to do this a fully mappable ECU really is the only way to go. I don't know of specific prices for things like the HKS F-Con (Fuel controller) but as part of their NSX tuning packages TDI offer a 'modified ECU' for £495
I don't know exactly what this entails but a full Fuel and Ignition controller to go with your VTEC change over really is the safest way forward...

I would think you're talking upwards of £1000 in all (again, from my turbo charged background fully mappable ECU's available such as GEMS - £1500, MoTECH M800 £1800, ApexI - £1000)
Yes it's MUCH more than £35 but that should tell you something about exactly what you're getting for £35.

I don't claim to be an expert and I'm not telling you to do it or not... It's just my view.
If it was me I'd save up and get the full mapped ECU... Speak to an experienced NSX tuner before doing anything though.

[Senninha]

This chip has been regularly advertised. I think simonprelude researched it and found it 'missing' from the Spoon catologue :confused:

I dont think I would risk it myself. I have heard that Starchips offer an NSX chip for a few hundred ££'s. I've been told by someone that has this installed that it improves torgue on the 3.0 at lower revs.

HTH

Paul

[simonprelude]

I would not use any of these cheap plug in chips.

If you want to just lower the high cam engagement point then I think the Apexi VAFC is compatible, however I would still be a little cautious. However at least it does alter the fuelling also which the "Spoon" one might not.

Also if it is a Spoon one it will probably be tuned to run on a minimum of 100 RON so not sure what running 97 or even 95 RON will do.

£35, 14 bhp and an £12000 new engine in how many months ??
Don't think I would risk it.

[AR]

I think this is what you are after, according to King Motorsports ( Mugen distributor for the US ) they used them with 93 octane with no ill effects.

Cheers

AR

[Paul]

Maybe I won't be plugging this chip in as soon as possible ... seems like it could be a bit risky ... shame I didn't have a bit mroe patience and let the auction run its course without making a bid ... still you live and learn!

Thanks to all for the input ... anyone want a chip that could give you up to an extra 14bhp ... £35 ono ... ;-)

[ctrlaltdelboy]

one other feature which is sometimes present in aftermarket chips is the raising or even removal of the fuel-cut point.

personally I find myself occasionally 'bouncing' off the limiter if getting a bit carried away, and whenever that happens I am grateful that it is there - much better than accidentally crunching the pistons etc through venturing into rpm territories that the engine just can't deal with.

[Procar Specials]

At a car like NSX, ’chiptuning’ and lowering the VTEC point with an adjustable controller can be very expensive.
There is a lot of scrap at the market.

We wanna tell about our experiences:

We started testing such parts in year 1998-
We ordered 2 FIELD and SPOON VTEC controllers for the NSX and the ITR.
At the NSX we lowered the VTEC point to 5.000 and 5.500 rpms, with no better
acceleration as result.
At the dyno we lost 5 HP, so we sended that part back.

We installed another FIELD controller (it came with a plug and play adapter) at our ITR, after 1 year, the engine began to spin.
Sometimes the engine runed with only 3 cylinders,
at the points we wanted to check that, all was fine again.
We changed spark plugs and many other parts, at last we removed the VTEC controller
and all was fine again. We stopped thinking about others.

Finally we found another part for the NSX, (it’s a complete ECU) which is amazing.
But it doesn’t lowering the VTEC point.
We got this from HONDA R&D Europe, but its only for 92+93 NSX's.

[mutley]

HI Paul,

I spotted the chip too (ebay) and thought about it. But to me I just thought that anything that cheap can't be that good.

I'm just asking if you ever did install the chip and if you did, was it any good??

cheers
Jim

[Paul]

HI Paul,

I spotted the chip too (ebay) and thought about it. But to me I just thought that anything that cheap can't be that good.

I'm just asking if you ever did install the chip and if you did, was it any good??

cheers
Jim
The chip hadn't arrived after a week ... :!:

So, I managed to get in touch with the seller and calcel the purchase ... he eventually refunded me my money ... eventually being in excess of a couple of weeks ... :!:

Probably saved myself a packed in the long run ... as has been pointed out here ... it need a lot more than just a chip to get an increase in power that won't kill the engine.

Best avoided I would suggest ... I think I had a lucky escape ... although I wouldn't have installed the chip after the comments posted here.

[mutley]

Yeah, wise move, I won't bother either. I think if I am going to get the car "chipped" I would go to a specialist like superchips.

Do you know if anyone on here has had a car chipped?? maybe I'll start a new thread.

Jim

[AR]

I think Kevin and Modarr had theirs at one point done, I might be wrong.

[Senninha]

I think Kevin and Modarr had theirs at one point done, I might be wrong.

I think the guys managed to replicate the Mugen chip with good results but be warned, it does (as Darren suggests) remove the red line cut out which could be a costly oversight when the red mist comes in

[mutley]

ooooooooooooo I see what you mean, I like the fact that a rev limiter is there, last thing I want to see are piston parts flying through the back window