Air Con Recharge

[Steveycaz]

My A/C Unit is not really kicking out much in the way of cold air. I am sure it is the original, so 1991. I seem to remember that these old units need to be recharged with modern coolant and that necessitates changes to valves and washers. Does anyone have any experience with this and an idea on costs?

[Paul G]

Hi Steve,

There is a guy over in Alton who was very helpful with my brothers NSX, I'll try and sort out his details.

Martin, Can you rember this guys details? (as I think you may have had some work done, and it was you who gave me the contact in the first place)

Cheers

PG

[Kevin]

Its about £100 for Honda to fit the parts. The newer coolant though is cheaper than refilling with a compatible older style coolant, so the cost balances out.

[Martin]

Hello Steve and Paul

I can't remember the name of the company in Alton. If I come across any details around the house I'll post here.

Cheers
Martin

[Steveycaz]

Thanks guys!

[Steveycaz]

I spoke with Honda. They have no kit to modify the a/c to use new coolant. They say my only option is an a/c specifist. Have any of you tracked down the contact details for suppliers you've used and would recommend?

[Minch]

Steve,

One of the NSX engineers at Chiswick (can't remember his name) mentioned an air con specialist just round the corner from Chiswick. I'll try and dig out the number. He gave the number to me after I had a ridiculous quote from Honda UK to fit a new air con system in mine!

[TheSebringOne]

With the hotter weather, I noted the Air Con does'nt blow any cold air? During winter I was told to use air con for short periods to stop build up of condensation & minimise rust in the units? I assume reading above its common that the air con needs refilling/recharging? Was the £100 a total price from Honda to refill/recharge the unit? or are independants better value? I can't believe Honda only charge £100 when they're charge an arm & a leg? Does the lack of use, 3000miles in 3 years cause problems due to lack of use or is it due for its first recharge/refill at 35-36k miles ? Feeling like a roasted animal on a spit at the moment! Cheers :rolleyes:

[Martin]

Steve

Try my NSX technician on 07736 668 350. If he doesn't do it himself, he will at least have a good contact that can.

Cheers
Martin

[Kevin]

No conversion kit?

http://www.daliracing.com/v666-5/catalog/index_browse_part.cfm?focus=1558

I was told by Honda Norton Way, that the parts that need converting are just the valves, as the fittings for the newer type of coolant are different to the old ones. That is what is in this kit by the looks of it.

[mutley]

On the topic of Air con ( although nothing to do with recharging)

While up on ramps, pre MoT, I noticed that my air con stuff hasn't been totally removed. The condenser unit thingy on the passenger side is still there. As it's probably the only part that's left, any one want it? No good to me.

Cheers

Jim

(P.S if anyone want is at Japfest, bring some spanners, but preferably before the BBQ as spanners and beer usually gets messy)

[Steveycaz]

I spoke with Martin's NSX Technician (he's got his own one, how cool is that? :cool: ) and he has put me in touch with a company in Farnham called Air Care Autos. They have done several NSX's including conversions from CFC. Assuming they don't find any leaks the cost is £120. I'm booked in for May.

[TheSebringOne]

Well done steveycaz !

Martin, would your technician friend advise me on a later 1999 model? As mines not blowing any cold air & probably just needs recharging. Thanks James :D

[Steveycaz]

Well I've done a bit more research. Apparently I have two routes available to me; convert the system to use modern R134a coolant, which involves changing valves, seals, o-rings etc.. I have been quoted around £300 for this. Other option is to use a coolant called RS24, which is designed for older R12 systems like on the 1991 NSX but without the nasty bits. The latter option requires no conversion. This will cost me £70 including a full servicing of the air con.

Anyone any experience of the RS24 option?

[Paul]

Well I've done a bit more research. Apparently I have two routes available to me; convert the system to use modern R134a coolant, which involves changing valves, seals, o-rings etc.. I have been quoted around £300 for this. Other option is to use a coolant called RS24, which is designed for older R12 systems like on the 1991 NSX but without the nasty bits. The latter option requires no conversion. This will cost me £70 including a full servicing of the air con.

Anyone any experience of the RS24 option?No experience of RS24 ... but need to get my air con checked and hopefully just recharged as mine is not chilling the air any longer ... it did when I got it almost 3 years ago, but it seems to have given up the ghost now and just circulates the air for me ... meanling I'm now getting rather warm in this lovelty whether we're enjoying!

Is the firm you've found in Farnham able to re-charge your system ... using RS24 for the excellent price that is below three digits:?:

[Paul]

I spoke with Martin's NSX Technician (he's got his own one, how cool is that? :cool: ) and he has put me in touch with a company in Farnham called Air Care Autos. They have done several NSX's including conversions from CFC. Assuming they don't find any leaks the cost is £120. I'm booked in for May.I've done a search on "Yell" for 'Air Care Autos' in all five of the 'Farnham's' that show up, but can't find an exact match ... any chance you can post their phone number ... :?:

Cheers.

[Steveycaz]

I've done a search on "Yell" for 'Air Care Autos' in all five of the 'Farnham's' that show up, but can't find an exact match ... any chance you can post their phone number ... :?:

Cheers.

They're actually nearer Godalming although have a Farnham number. I haven't got it anymore as I am using a company in Chineham called Cool Cars on 07816 917672 . The others I phoned didn't tell me about the RS24 option - wanting instead for me to pay for a £300+ conversion so yah-boo-sucks to them! I've done a bit of a Google on the stuff and apparently it is a good replacement to R12 (if you're car is that old). Otherwise any Car Air Conditioning firm will be able to service and refil your system.

[Martin]

Hello 'TheSebringOne' aka James!

Sorry I have just noticed this thread...I dont check all the threads, so I missed this one 'til now.

Haven't been ignoring you....honest :-) Did you give Mr NSX technician a call on the number I supplied in an attempt to help you with your ABS query?

Cheers
Martin

[TheSebringOne]

No problems Martin, at least you have replied, its not the ABS, but aircon refill query that I have! U were'nt playing it too cool with your replies? " I wish I can keep cool at present " I haven't had a chance but I will ring him up as I been to Liverpool today as off work, with virtually no cold air & roasted like a pig, might save Simon some meat & roasting at his Japfest BBQ! The other thing is that I don't live anywhere near your technician, so was'nt 100% sure if I should bother him? Thanks :D

[Paul]

They're actually nearer Godalming although have a Farnham number. I haven't got it anymore as I am using a company in Chineham called Cool Cars on 07816 917672 . The others I phoned didn't tell me about the RS24 option - wanting instead for me to pay for a £300+ conversion so yah-boo-sucks to them! I've done a bit of a Google on the stuff and apparently it is a good replacement to R12 (if you're car is that old). Otherwise any Car Air Conditioning firm will be able to service and refil your system.A company in Chneham eh :?: ... very useful as they're probably only 5 minutes from my house :!:

I'll give them a call in the morning and see when they can fit me in ... cheers for the update, especially regarding the others not being helpful about the RS24 option ... which I take it Cool Cars did discuss and offer as an option :?:

[Steveycaz]

Hi Paul. Neil from Cool Cars is supposed to be recharging my NSX with RS24 this afternoon - I will post an update. Only worrying thing is he is declining my offer of seeing the relevant sections from the workshop manual claiming 'he's been doing this for years'. I might be paranoid but I am going to sit with him while he does it. I'll let you know if I can recommend him after the event.

cheers.

S.

[Paul]

Hi Paul. Neil from Cool Cars is supposed to be recharging my NSX with RS24 this afternoon - I will post an update. Only worrying thing is he is declining my offer of seeing the relevant sections from the workshop manual claiming 'he's been doing this for years'. I might be paranoid but I am going to sit with him while he does it. I'll let you know if I can recommend him after the event.

cheers.

S.Thanks for the info Steve ... I'll wait till you've seen what their work is like before calling or booking mine in then ... hopefully the fact that he's been doing it for years will be a good thing and it's not just him being blase or arrogant.

[Paul G]

Hi Guys,

Bit late for Steveycaz, but I have just stumbled across the Air Con guy in Alton, the same guy that Martin mentioned earlier!

01420 80808 - I think the guys name is Gary, was very helpfull the last time I spoke to him.

Let us know how you get on.

Cheers

PG

[Steveycaz]

OK! Spent my £70 and the aircon is now working incredibly well. The guy from Cool Cars drained it, vacuum testing it for 20 minutes then recharged and reoiled it. So far so good.

[TheSebringOne]

Great news that the X now feels cool! I also hope it stays that way. You mentioned this air con guy done a few Xs already, any later ones like a 99 as I need my recharging or re-gasing ASAP as its summer & get roasted when the suns out! £70 sounds amazing good value, did the guy say there some gaurantee? :(

[mutley]

Hmmmmm air con............. I open a window!!!

[Steveycaz]

Hmmmmm air con............. I open a window!!!

Tried that, but I get dreadful buffetting above 140mph :cool:

[mutley]

Tried that, but I get dreadful buffetting above 140mph :cool:


well you always try those plastic wind deflector things??

Jim

[Steveycaz]

Great news that the X now feels cool! I also hope it stays that way. You mentioned this air con guy done a few Xs already, any later ones like a 99 as I need my recharging or re-gasing ASAP as its summer & get roasted when the suns out! £70 sounds amazing good value, did the guy say there some gaurantee? :(

This was the first NSX he'd worked on but he had no trouble finding the valves and getting on with it. Took him half an hour all up. Your's will be an up-to-date system so will be standard refrigerant (IIRC it's called R134a) - I'd have thought that any local air con servicing company could do it. No guarantee and he did say that, as the system is charged to 250psi if there any weaknesses they might 'go' in the next few days. If they don't then it shouldbe fine. I think this is more a factor for older cars.

[TheSebringOne]

Thanks Steve for the info about R134a for newer cars. Another way to stay cool is Jezza in car water shower unit as shown on the American cars trip to New Oleans, very funny, had me in stiches! Where Hamster had a BBQ & James May a hanger for his linen jackets! ;)

[Paul]

Does anyone know the dates when the coolants in the air con system changed ... and when they were and the coolants they changed from and to ... :?:

I need to check to see if my '96 JDM can be recharged in the same way with the same gas ... RS24 I recall ... that SteveCaz had his system recharged with.

However, if the change over is somewhere between ... or around ... '94 to '96 ... I need to be a little careful as whilst the lovely peeps DVLA have plated my NSX as a '96 ... the NSX mechanic at Reading Honda seems to think it may be as early as '94 ... partly due to it still having the fan in the engine bay on the opposite side from the air filter ... :!:

Any help would be grately appreciated ... I'm hoping to get my system recharged before JapFest ... thanks :)

[Steveycaz]

Does anyone know the dates when the coolants in the air con system changed ... and when they were and the coolants they changed from and to ... :?:

You can check visually Paul. The valves on the pipes where the refrigerant is drained/charged are very different in size between the R12 and later R134a systems. The R12 are smaller, with a valve cap about 1/2 inch across. The later ones are at least an inch across. I have seen both systems so could have a look at yours and compare it to mine (ooer!) if you like?

[Paul]

SteveCaz ... you have PM ... :)

[Paul]

Thanks for pointing out that I have small ones Steve ... mind you as yours are small you can't boast anyway ;-) ... thats small valves on our air con systems :-o

I'm now booked in to have my system recharged on Friday afternoon ... although with all this dull and wet weather ... maybe I could have left it anotehr week or two ... :lol:

[Paul]

All done! I now have a nicely cooled NSX again, although with the current weather it might be a few days before I need to actually use the air con!

Would be more than happy to recommend Neil [Cool Cars] for anyone who needs their system recharging, his number is in a previous post in this thread. He can recharge modern R134 systems, as well as recharging older R12 systems by using a modern day replacement coolant called RS24, the cost of the later being a paltry £70.

Many garages may tell you that your older R12 system will need converting, but what they probably won't tell you is that it is possible to use a modern and completely legal replacement coolant, R24, without the need to undertake a costly convertion. Although should you question why they can't just recharge it with RS24, they may well say they don't use that coolant, or can't, saying that they are only able to do a convertion for you.

Thanks to SteveCaz for his research into getting older systems recharged and for managing to find someone who can do it at a reasonable cost.

[TheSebringOne]

Size isn't everything Paul! ;) You said R134 for newer air con systems, I assume my 99 is would use this? :rolleyes:

[Paul]

Size isn't everything Paul! ;) You said R134 for newer air con systems, I assume my 99 is would use this? :rolleyes:You'll need to check the two valves that are used to drain/recharge the system.
They can be located at the locations pointed to in the below image ... or at least they are in the locations indicated on my car ... maybe newer systems have the valve located in different places.
The valve near the headlight is the high pressure valve and should have a red coloured cap ... the valve lower down and further back near the bulkhead is the low pressure valve and should have a black cap on it.
If the caps on your valves are about half an inch across then you have an older R12 system which can be recharged with RS24.
If the caps are significantly more than about half an inch across then you have a newer system which I think is likely to use R134a :?: but you'll need to check first if your valves are of the larger variety.

[TheSebringOne]

Thanks Paul, did you draw that yourself? Lost vocation?! If so very impressive! :D Maybe a picture with digital camera might have been quicker? ;)

[Paul]

Thanks Paul, did you draw that yourself? Lost vocation?! If so very impressive! :D Maybe a picture with digital camera might have been quicker? ;)I'd love to say it was a quick sketch I put together ... but alas it is just a section from a diagram in the service manual ... :p

[Steveycaz]

Well I got my R12 AirCon system recharged with RS24 in May as you can see from this thread. It did only cost £70 and it did work fine. Now though, 4 months down the line, I have almost no cold air coming through whatsoever. Anyone else had this problem?

[TheSebringOne]

Had my re-gassed July at HUK for a standard charge of 72 squids, still ok but only drive her once a week or less! but think mines a newer system, hence different gas? I would go back to the company and make an enquiry or complain, since it should last at least a year or two even if used daily! HUK only refill the system and don't clean the system out first, unless you ask or pay!