VMAX - Anyone going

[NoelWatson]

I'm going to this next weekend - is anyone else planning to go?

http://www.pistonheads.co.uk/gassing/forum.asp?h=0&f=133
http://www.vmax15000bhp.com/

[Senninha]

Just out of interest, where is it please?

Looks like the NSX record stands at 160mph for our very own Track Demon! :thumbsup:

Regards, Paul

[NoelWatson]

Bruntingthorpe

I am aiming for 160 also

[simonprelude]

Hopefully it won't be too hot, TD and I both could only manage 156mph last year about the same time of year :(

[dan the man]

156 sounds real poor eh.

I had true 160 GPS in the DC5 with more to come in high summer. Bit of a hill mind. I would have thought the X should fly through 160 :(

[TheQuietOne]

Dan I think this is over a mile or something on an air strip...

I've had 165 out of mine over a decent distance and I'm sure the 180 Leigh has seen on numerous occasions is very possible!

[Papalazarou]

Dan I think this is over a mile or something on an air strip...

I've had 165 out of mine over a decent distance and I'm sure the 180 Leigh has seen on numerous occasions is very possible!

You dog you!

Cheers,

James.

[simonprelude]

Yes it's the 2 mile runway at Bruntingthorpe.

The weather was so hot that everyone was struggling.

But at least we beat the non Turbo Porsche guys and the Supra :)
(I think we were quicker than the Ferrari also)

[dan the man]

Makes sense now. with more of a run could go higher and with decent cool air.

good luck to X boys who attend

[trackdemon]

I may be there, but if so will be as photographer and probably in my Peugeot 205 beater....

There's definately a little more to come than 160mph, the rev drop from 4th-5th really killed acceleration as your just out of VTEC and at 140mph+ you travel a long way before getting back into the zone.... 2miles not enough.

I did comprehensively destroy the Supra in a head to head, and everything round the corners ;)

[NoelWatson]

OK, I've filled the tank with V-Power, reset the ECU, is there anything else I can do to optimise speed? What are the optimum change up points for the 6 speed box, on the limiter or around 7500? And what was your speedo showing when you went through the traps - Top Gear had an indicated 175 at Bruntingthorpe

http://nsxcb.co.uk/testvb/attachment.php?attachmentid=2539&d=1186672267

[Senninha]

The other tactic to employ, assuming you've removed weight by leaving toolkit and spare in the garage, would be to flat shift up the box. This should get you upto speed quicker and give you a bit more time over the 140 wall. It is hard on the clutch if you keep doing it but for a one off run should be ok.

Obvious I know, but make sure all your levels are spot on and tyres correctly inflated. Try to run with a low fuel level.

Good luck and let us now when you've set a new club max!

regards, Paul

[dan the man]

God speed!!!

[mutley]

Will be really interesting to see what speed you hit, keep us informed.

Good Luck

Jim

[TheSebringOne]

Paul, does flat change mean taking the car right up to the rev limiter in each gear before changing up? Fluids level are all correct, especially engine oil? I thought you should put a bit more PSI in the tyres over the recommended 33 & 40 on 215 & 245? or what ever for 205 & 225, 215 & 255. Finally I assume to take to advantage of lower weight via lower fuel loads, is there a filling station nearby or maybe take a gerry can? :)

[Senninha]

Flat shifting = changing up without lifting off the throttle :yes:

[Kevin]

When you start down the runway, begin at the very left hand side, and drive diagonally to the right of the finish line.

The extra few metres allows you to build up more speed.:D

[NoelWatson]

161 mph. Getting to 160 was easy - just leave it in 5th and it hits the limiter before the timing beam @160. Once in 6th acceleration tails of noticably.

[dan the man]

So a true 160.. so 170 on the clock doable for scarin passengers

[Silver Surfer]

Results on here. http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&t=428585

Beaten by a Porsche 928GT and M3 and Monaro! :(:(

SS

[TheSebringOne]

DTM, with your light/slim frame, maybe 165 is do able! Even after removing the spare wheel, tools & light fuel load that is! :D

Well done Noel as a 360 only beat you by 4 mph! Was it wet? what was the temperature? quite cool?

Q.s Why loads of N/As?, Y 5 mph difference bewteen left & right for the Porker 996 Turbo (Is this what you mean Kevin?)

No surprise a Vauxhall retired!

[NoelWatson]

TheSebringOne,

It was wet in the morning but had dried out by the afternoon. I'm guessing temperature was around 18 degrees. The N/A's are because people haven't got round to posting yet. The 928 that beat me was the 330 bhp version, and I believe the Monaro was the one with the 500+ on it's bootlid. There was no way I was going to get to 165 - it makes me doubt Honda's claim of 175 - I may go to Germany to see if it is possible. There was some debate over the accuracy of the timing beams, but I know that the 6 speed NSX is geared for 160 in 5th and I could hit this quite comfortably

http://home.austin.rr.com/zuerst/NSX/spec.htm

so I'm confident that my 161 (achieved twice - once with passenger) was accurate.

[NSXGB]

Most of the stats that I have seen record top speed of 167 for the NSX not 175? If it is 167, yours seems about right to me....





TheSebringOne,

It was wet in the morning but had dried out by the afternoon. I'm guessing temperature was around 18 degrees. The N/A's are because people haven't got round to posting yet. The 928 that beat me was the 330 bhp version, and I believe the Monaro was the one with the 500+ on it's bootlid. There was no way I was going to get to 165 - it makes me doubt Honda's claim of 175 - I may go to Germany to see if it is possible. There was some debate over the accuracy of the timing beams, but I know that the 6 speed NSX is geared for 160 in 5th and I could hit this quite comfortably

http://home.austin.rr.com/zuerst/NSX/spec.htm

so I'm confident that my 161 (achieved twice - once with passenger) was accurate.

[NoelWatson]

Most of the stats that I have seen record top speed of 167 for the NSX not 175? If it is 167, yours seems about right to me....

Apparently the 2002 facelift improved top speed due to aerodynamic changes

http://www.internetautoguide.com/reviews/45-int/sports-cars/acura/nsx/2002/index.html

[TheSebringOne]

Simon, give or take 1 mph, I've also read 168mph seems the most common claim :)

Noel, do you own a 02+? Maybe with the improved aero body kits & a rumoured 300+ BHP, 175mph is possible? Read that its a full second quicker than a 97+ in the standing quarter drag?

[NoelWatson]

Simon, give or take 1 mph, I've also read 168mph seems the most common claim :)

Noel, do you own a 02+? Maybe with the improved aero body kits & a rumoured 300+ BHP, 175mph is possible? Read that its a full second quicker than a 97+ in the standing quarter drag?

It is a 2004, but I am more than willing to bet it hasn't got 300+bhp or it would've done more than 161 (unless my driving was that bad). I think the car that Honda released to the press in '02

http://www.channel4.com/4car/media/100-greatest/03-large/47-honda-nsx.jpg

was "optimised" - it did 172 round Millbrook which equates to 180 on the flat.
Even the 02 Type R appeared to get hammered by a CSL in Autocar 2003 0-100-0 test - although I haven't got that issue yet (maybe it was a private car and they couldn't cane it)

http://www.nsxprime.com/forums/showthread.php?t=32686


I am tempted to go over to Germany for a driving holiday and see what mine will do given a long enough straight.
I was going to get it on the rolling road a few weekends back but it was cancelled.

Here is the pic of me at the starting line

http://www.pistonheads.co.uk/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&t=428818

[TheSebringOne]

Noel, nice pic o f your X on the strip & great colour! Maybe it does'nt have 300+, but its well known they are quicker than a 97+? I read somewhere that its a full second over a standing quarter in a couple of mags, maybe this was the tweaked 02 press car as you say? I have a copy of the said Autocar mag with 0 to 100 & back test. The NA02+ NSX Type R was beaten by the CSL & 996 GT3, its 0 to 60 was 4.8, not 4.4 as Evo mag claims. Would be interesting to get a 02+ on a rolling road as I think the only ones on this forum are NA1 3.0 & NA2 97+, but no 02+. Interesting Paul got 289 bHP in his 98 NA2 on a rolling road and beat a RS4! & maybe a CSL? :)

[markc]

Odd... I have a copy of this mag (Autocar 30th July 2003) with their annual 0-100-0 challenge and there is no sign of several of the cars mentioned in the Prime thread?

Neither the NSX-R, M3CSL or GT3 (or indeed Enzo, 350Z, RX8, TT3.2 etc) we're tested in this issue as far as I can tell.

I suspect that someone has collected stats from the annual tests prior to and post the 2003 year one and presented them all together.

Not a big deal but just like rolling road results the figures are only truely comparable with identical conditions during the same day.

Noel, happy to scan my copy for you, but there's no NSX-R in it!

Mark (The Pedant :) )

[mutley]

Sorry if this is already mentioned, but for the top speed runs, what distance is the run? Just curious, I'm sure that the NSX can go a bit above 161.

I thought about trying out a rolling road, but ofcourse with that you dont get the drag taken into consideration (or do you??)

Answers on a postacard to the usual address

Jim

[NoelWatson]

Noel, nice pic o f your X on the strip & great colour! Maybe it does'nt have 300+, but its well known they are quicker than a 97+? I read somewhere that its a full second over a standing quarter in a couple of mags, maybe this was the tweaked 02 press car as you say? I have a copy of the said Autocar mag with 0 to 100 & back test. The NA02+ NSX Type R was beaten by the CSL & 996 GT3, its 0 to 60 was 4.8, not 4.4 as Evo mag claims. Would be interesting to get a 02+ on a rolling road as I think the only ones on this forum are NA1 3.0 & NA2 97+, but no 02+. Interesting Paul got 289 bHP in his 98 NA2 on a rolling road and beat a RS4! & maybe a CSL? :)

What was the date of the Autocar 0-100-0? I assumed it was 2003, but Mark has confirmed it wasn't so guess it must be some time in 2004.
If anyone who went to the original rolling road day

http://nsxcb.co.uk/testvb/showthread.php?t=1757

fancies going to another, I may take mine to Surrey Rolling Road

http://www.surreyrollingroad.co.uk/

one weekday evening - think it is around £50




Sorry if this is already mentioned, but for the top speed runs, what distance is the run? Just curious, I'm sure that the NSX can go a bit above 161.

I thought about trying out a rolling road, but ofcourse with that you dont get the drag taken into consideration (or do you??)

Answers on a postacard to the usual address

Jim


I think it is around 1.7 miles before you have to brake - and you come onto the runway at about 70 mph. I will upload some videos when I get round to compressing them.

[simonprelude]

I'll be up for that.

Also looking at doing VMAX again at some stage, especially one where the track and air temperatures are not near 40c.



If anyone who went to the original rolling road day

http://nsxcb.co.uk/testvb/showthread.php?t=1757

fancies going to another, I may take mine to Surrey Rolling Road

http://www.surreyrollingroad.co.uk/

[markc]

Hi Noel,

Let me know when you plan to go along to Surrey Rolling Road. I live about 4 miles from it and pass it on the way to work and back everyday. About time I put the NSX on the rollers to make sure all is well with the engine (mixture through the rev range etc) and indeed the total pony count.

I popped along to the last Pistonheads session just for a look-see and whitnessed the brutality of a 600hp Supra on the rollers 8-0

Cheers

Mark

[NoelWatson]

I spoke to Charlie a few weeks back and he said a midweek evening session was a possibility (Simon is this OK with you). I will give him a ring and see what dates he has available.

[simonprelude]

That's fine, what time in the evening do they go up to ??


I spoke to Charlie a few weeks back and he said a midweek evening session was a possibility (Simon is this OK with you). I will give him a ring and see what dates he has available.

[trackdemon]

Hi Noel,

I was there in the Z4 Coupe (non-M), meant to come say hello but was pretty busy between photgraphy & drifting over the other side @ lunchtime ;)

Wouldn't worry too much about achieving 'only' 161mph - your car was rated 1st for sheer bl00dy beauty. My god thats a good looking car... reminded me what a brilliant car I'm lucky enough to have stewardship of!

Got some nice shots of your car, they'll be posted in due course.

cheers,
Steve

[jaytip]

Odd... I have a copy of this mag (Autocar 30th July 2003) with their annual 0-100-0 challenge and there is no sign of several of the cars mentioned in the Prime thread?

Neither the NSX-R, M3CSL or GT3 (or indeed Enzo, 350Z, RX8, TT3.2 etc) we're tested in this issue as far as I can tell.

I suspect that someone has collected stats from the annual tests prior to and post the 2003 year one and presented them all together.

Not a big deal but just like rolling road results the figures are only truely comparable with identical conditions during the same day.

Noel, happy to scan my copy for you, but there's no NSX-R in it!

Mark (The Pedant :) )
I don't know what year it's from but i have/had that edition so it definately exists,and sadly,yes the Type-R was beaten by the GT3 and the CSL.

[jaytip]

I'm well chuffed to see my new wheels posting such a good time(173mph):) Don't know if thats a modified car or not though??

[NoelWatson]

Hi Noel,

I was there in the Z4 Coupe (non-M), meant to come say hello but was pretty busy between photgraphy & drifting over the other side @ lunchtime ;)

Wouldn't worry too much about achieving 'only' 161mph - your car was rated 1st for sheer bl00dy beauty. My god thats a good looking car... reminded me what a brilliant car I'm lucky enough to have stewardship of!

Got some nice shots of your car, they'll be posted in due course.

cheers,
Steve

Steve,

I guess I took the looks for granted when I was going backwards against the Porkers! Is this you drifting the GT3

http://www.trackdemon.co.uk/IMAGES/EVENTS/VMAX/2007-08-19/Porsche_996_GT3_2007-08-19_DSC0185-01.jpg

I believe this is the 996 GT3 Mk2 - something that is looking surprisingly cheap compared to GT3 Mk1.

http://www.pistonheads.co.uk/sales/224949.htm

How do the NSX and GT3 compare?

[TheSebringOne]

Found the said Autocar mag, its dated 27 April 2004! The Type R (can't tell from reg as blurred, think its the 53 reg or Fuzilov's car) 0-60 4.91, 0-100 11.41. Reaction time 0.38 and 100 to 0 4.41, total 0 - 100 & back to 0 is 16.20. CSL's was 4.62, 10.82, 0.48, 3.95 & 15.25 respectively! HTH :)

JayJip, thats in your lovely RS6 Advant is'nt it!? 444 BHP & Quattro AWD? :eek: Is it de-restricted as should be 155 max limited?

[jaytip]

JayJip, thats in your lovely RS6 Advant is'nt it!? 444 BHP & Quattro AWD? :eek: Is it de-restricted as should be 155 max limited?
No,no.Ive got a B5(the first ones)RS4. 380 BHP but no limiter,or so i'm told.

[trackdemon]

Steve,

I guess I took the looks for granted when I was going backwards against the Porkers! Is this you drifting the GT3

http://www.trackdemon.co.uk/IMAGES/EVENTS/VMAX/2007-08-19/Porsche_996_GT3_2007-08-19_DSC0185-01.jpg

I believe this is the 996 GT3 Mk2 - something that is looking surprisingly cheap compared to GT3 Mk1.

http://www.pistonheads.co.uk/sales/224949.htm

How do the NSX and GT3 compare?

Hi Noel,

Yeah thats me, Sam asked me to give him some tuition and I think in that shot I'm pointing at where we're going to illustrate line of sight... happy days!

I have to say, I absolutely love the GT3 in all iterations.... in many ways the 997GT3 is the best all round performance car I've driven (Caterham / Atom may give a bigger hit but try driving to South of France in one!). The 996 is not far behind, perhaps being a little less refined for road use.

Compared to NSX? Well chalk and cheese really:

The NSX drivetrain is easily the equal of the GT3. NSX is smoother, and sounds better : GT3 is more powerful. Both have brilliant throttle response and expansive linear powerbands. The NSX gearchange is much better (than most things really).

The GT3 has much better brakes for track use, the gap would be closed on road.

The biggest difference is in the chassis' tuning and resultant dynamic behaviour. The GT3 is clearly setup with a keen eye on track ability & consequently its firmly sprung. Turn in is scalpel sharp, much sharper than the NSX's calmer dynamic approach. Overall I prefer the GT3 steering - more feedback, lighter and more responsive. The rear is pretty well tied down, its easy to push the rear out under power (see pic above ;)) but is much much easier to control than the NSX beyond the limits. Overall a thrilling drive on track, very very capable and of course its built like a Porsche so feels like it'll take hard use for a long time... much like the NSX.
I have only driven a 996GT3 road briefly, but I have driven a 997GT3 extensively on road so I'll use that as a reference point because they don't feel vastly different.
Compared to the NSX the GT3 is much more lively, more responsive to surface changes (cambers, bumps, differing grip levels etc.) and generally fidgets and moves around constantly when you've got any load in the chassis. Whether you think this is a good thing or not is probably a matter of taste as much as deciding which is 'best'. Personally I love it, the car feels so alive underneath you, yet never conveying a feeling its working against you.... whilst it does react to the road it never deviates from your chosen line unless you tell it to using throttle or steering.
In this respect it is almost the polar opposite of the NSX, which is just so composed and unflustered on a b-road. Its very very impressive. The NSX's chassis clearly has a strong road biase, hence its relatively soft springing & long suspension travel married to superb damping. Its too soft for track use really (the reason I retired mine from track use).
I think in many ways the NSX chassis / engine package is just about perfect for road use. It has just the right amount of power to feel fast, make for easy overtaking & push the chassis but its not so fast you find yourself unable to use the full rev range. The chassis again, is spot on - just enough grip to be exciting and fast but not so much the limits are nigh unapproachable.

Which leaves me to wonder whether you'd be able to use and enjoy as much of the GT3's performance as you can the NSX? My hunch is that you could use almost as much albeit the speeds would be higher and - maybe - a touch scarier. Both cars are bl00dy brilliant, and fulfil their respective roles fantastically well.......

Personally the 997GT3 is on my 'own one' list at some point, but I'd be happy to try a 996 on the way. ;) Now, if someone would just loan me a NA2 Type R.......

[Martin]

Found the said Autocar mag, its dated 27 April 2004! The Type R (can't tell from reg as blurred, think its the 53 reg or Fuzilov's car) 0-60 4.91, 0-100 11.41.


Well I think this just goes to show it depends who is driving. The same mag tested a standard 97+ NSX at 0-100 in 10.9! Me thinks Type-r is faster :-)

[Martin]

Hi Noel,

Yeah thats me, Sam asked me to give him some tuition and I think in that shot I'm pointing at where we're going to illustrate line of sight... happy days!

I have to say, I absolutely love the GT3 in all iterations.... in many ways the 997GT3 is the best all round performance car I've driven (Caterham / Atom may give a bigger hit but try driving to South of France in one!). The 996 is not far behind, perhaps being a little less refined for road use.

Compared to NSX? Well chalk and cheese really:

The NSX drivetrain is easily the equal of the GT3. NSX is smoother, and sounds better : GT3 is more powerful. Both have brilliant throttle response and expansive linear powerbands. The NSX gearchange is much better (than most things really).

The GT3 has much better brakes for track use, the gap would be closed on road.

The biggest difference is in the chassis' tuning and resultant dynamic behaviour. The GT3 is clearly setup with a keen eye on track ability & consequently its firmly sprung. Turn in is scalpel sharp, much sharper than the NSX's calmer dynamic approach. Overall I prefer the GT3 steering - more feedback, lighter and more responsive. The rear is pretty well tied down, its easy to push the rear out under power (see pic above ;)) but is much much easier to control than the NSX beyond the limits. Overall a thrilling drive on track, very very capable and of course its built like a Porsche so feels like it'll take hard use for a long time... much like the NSX.
I have only driven a 996GT3 road briefly, but I have driven a 997GT3 extensively on road so I'll use that as a reference point because they don't feel vastly different.
Compared to the NSX the GT3 is much more lively, more responsive to surface changes (cambers, bumps, differing grip levels etc.) and generally fidgets and moves around constantly when you've got any load in the chassis. Whether you think this is a good thing or not is probably a matter of taste as much as deciding which is 'best'. Personally I love it, the car feels so alive underneath you, yet never conveying a feeling its working against you.... whilst it does react to the road it never deviates from your chosen line unless you tell it to using throttle or steering.
In this respect it is almost the polar opposite of the NSX, which is just so composed and unflustered on a b-road. Its very very impressive. The NSX's chassis clearly has a strong road biase, hence its relatively soft springing & long suspension travel married to superb damping. Its too soft for track use really (the reason I retired mine from track use).
I think in many ways the NSX chassis / engine package is just about perfect for road use. It has just the right amount of power to feel fast, make for easy overtaking & push the chassis but its not so fast you find yourself unable to use the full rev range. The chassis again, is spot on - just enough grip to be exciting and fast but not so much the limits are nigh unapproachable.

Which leaves me to wonder whether you'd be able to use and enjoy as much of the GT3's performance as you can the NSX? My hunch is that you could use almost as much albeit the speeds would be higher and - maybe - a touch scarier. Both cars are bl00dy brilliant, and fulfil their respective roles fantastically well.......

Personally the 997GT3 is on my 'own one' list at some point, but I'd be happy to try a 996 on the way. ;) Now, if someone would just loan me a NA2 Type R.......

Dude you should write for Evo

[TheSebringOne]

What a great read! Really has a Evo-ness quality!

As much as I love the NSX and would love a go in a NA2 Type R (have been in Bazza's NA1 though), I think it would be very close to a mk1 & mk2 996 GT3s, but a 997 GT3 stretches this a little more. Thats the impression of the said Evo Mag when I've read their drivers/writers poll like the driver's car of the decade & recent 997 GT3 V Fusilovs NA2 Type R! Ultimately two things were clear, the NSX is ageing and down over at least 100 bhp!

[TheSebringOne]

The Type R will be faster as its over 140KG lighter for starters. I've read the same somewhere saying 0 to 100 in 10.9 for standard 97+, but thats after the car ran in, when it was new, it was abut 11.5 second.

Sorry Jaytip, knew it was some kind of RS from the 3/4 ringer! ;)

[mutley]

I agree in respect that the NSX is ageing a little and that newer cars have a much higher BHP, but remember that porsche is still evolving and I'm sure there will be more powerfull cars to come from them and that if the NSX had a life span like the 911 (how long has that been going now?) etc, and that there were very little changes obviously from NA1 to NA2, then NSX-R variants, but only over 10-12 yrs.

I think if the NSX stayed in production today, I have no doubt that there would have been engine/chasis/suspension changes and much higher BHP figures to compete in todays supercar market.

The fact that the NSX can still hold it's own with these cars is phenomenal.

Jim

[TheSebringOne]

Totally agree Jim, the only reason it was killed off in 05 is the new tooling requirements to make the car meet new emissions targets, meant it was not economical. Also given the car never made Honda any money, then thats a second reason it was killed off! All olis down to economics :(

[jaytip]

I agree in respect that the NSX is ageing a little and that newer cars have a much higher BHP, but remember that porsche is still evolving and I'm sure there will be more powerfull cars to come from them and that if the NSX had a life span like the 911 (how long has that been going now?) etc, and that there were very little changes obviously from NA1 to NA2, then NSX-R variants, but only over 10-12 yrs.

I think if the NSX stayed in production today, I have no doubt that there would have been engine/chasis/suspension changes and much higher BHP figures to compete in todays supercar market.

The fact that the NSX can still hold it's own with these cars is phenomenal.

Jim
I'm not so sure.Remember up until very recently Japan had the stupid 276BHP gentlemens agreement.
If they decided to build another NSX now,then they have a free hand to build a car as powerful as they like.

[NoelWatson]

Hi Noel,

Yeah thats me, Sam asked me to give him some tuition and I think in that shot I'm pointing at where we're going to illustrate line of sight... happy days!

I have to say, I absolutely love the GT3 in all iterations.... in many ways the 997GT3 is the best all round performance car I've driven (Caterham / Atom may give a bigger hit but try driving to South of France in one!). The 996 is not far behind, perhaps being a little less refined for road use.

Compared to NSX? Well chalk and cheese really:

The NSX drivetrain is easily the equal of the GT3. NSX is smoother, and sounds better : GT3 is more powerful. Both have brilliant throttle response and expansive linear powerbands. The NSX gearchange is much better (than most things really).

The GT3 has much better brakes for track use, the gap would be closed on road.

The biggest difference is in the chassis' tuning and resultant dynamic behaviour. The GT3 is clearly setup with a keen eye on track ability & consequently its firmly sprung. Turn in is scalpel sharp, much sharper than the NSX's calmer dynamic approach. Overall I prefer the GT3 steering - more feedback, lighter and more responsive. The rear is pretty well tied down, its easy to push the rear out under power (see pic above ;)) but is much much easier to control than the NSX beyond the limits. Overall a thrilling drive on track, very very capable and of course its built like a Porsche so feels like it'll take hard use for a long time... much like the NSX.
I have only driven a 996GT3 road briefly, but I have driven a 997GT3 extensively on road so I'll use that as a reference point because they don't feel vastly different.
Compared to the NSX the GT3 is much more lively, more responsive to surface changes (cambers, bumps, differing grip levels etc.) and generally fidgets and moves around constantly when you've got any load in the chassis. Whether you think this is a good thing or not is probably a matter of taste as much as deciding which is 'best'. Personally I love it, the car feels so alive underneath you, yet never conveying a feeling its working against you.... whilst it does react to the road it never deviates from your chosen line unless you tell it to using throttle or steering.
In this respect it is almost the polar opposite of the NSX, which is just so composed and unflustered on a b-road. Its very very impressive. The NSX's chassis clearly has a strong road biase, hence its relatively soft springing & long suspension travel married to superb damping. Its too soft for track use really (the reason I retired mine from track use).
I think in many ways the NSX chassis / engine package is just about perfect for road use. It has just the right amount of power to feel fast, make for easy overtaking & push the chassis but its not so fast you find yourself unable to use the full rev range. The chassis again, is spot on - just enough grip to be exciting and fast but not so much the limits are nigh unapproachable.

Which leaves me to wonder whether you'd be able to use and enjoy as much of the GT3's performance as you can the NSX? My hunch is that you could use almost as much albeit the speeds would be higher and - maybe - a touch scarier. Both cars are bl00dy brilliant, and fulfil their respective roles fantastically well.......

Personally the 997GT3 is on my 'own one' list at some point, but I'd be happy to try a 996 on the way. ;) Now, if someone would just loan me a NA2 Type R.......

Fantastic write up, thankyou for taking the time. I agree that the NSX is more than fast enough for road use, but my first time at VMAX may have given me an itch that needs to be scratched. Interesting that you mentioned the Caterham\Atom. I was in Caterham the other day and had a chat about an R400 - I am going to take one for a test drive in the next few months. However, seeing how the Atom obliterates everything from 0-100 makes me think that it is worth investigating one of these.

[NoelWatson]

The Type R will be faster as its over 140KG lighter for starters. I've read the same somewhere saying 0 to 100 in 10.9 for standard 97+, but thats after the car ran in, when it was new, it was abut 11.5 second.

Sorry Jaytip, knew it was some kind of RS from the 3/4 ringer! ;)

The '97 car that Autocar were running did 0-100 in 12 seconds when new and 11.5 when run in. (write up in following book)

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Acura-Honda-NSX-Performance-Portfolio-1989-99/dp/1855204282/ref=sr_1_2/202-3181310-5502226?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1187852989&sr=1-2

The 10.9 was for the "optimised" '02 car. Does anyone know what happened to it?

[Martin]

No, I've seen 10.9 for the 97-02 car also.

Cheers
Martin

[Rob_Fenn]

I don't understand these times... 11 seconds is quick, the same as an Exige 240R. After the dyno runs we've seen on here it is clear Honda were actually honest with the 280bhp... so where does the NSX cut it's time?

[NoelWatson]

I don't understand these times... 11 seconds is quick, the same as an Exige 240R. After the dyno runs we've seen on here it is clear Honda were actually honest with the 280bhp... so where does the NSX cut it's time?

Rob,

Wikipedia states

"The combination of slightly-increased power and torque, 6-speed manual, and optimized gear ratio produced considerable improvements on the dragstrip. The new NSX rang up better numbers than the power and torque improvements may suggest over previous model NSXs"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honda_NSX

but I believe it is to do with the fact that it is producing near 280bhp over a large rev range so when accelerating your average bhp will be a lot greater than with a more peaky engine. The fact that 3rd reaches to 100 must make a difference. How do the drivetrain losses compare?

I don't think that aerodynamics has anything to do with it as Honda only claimed an improvement of 0-125mph of 0.1 seconds for the '02 facelift

[jaytip]

I don't understand these times... 11 seconds is quick, the same as an Exige 240R. After the dyno runs we've seen on here it is clear Honda were actually honest with the 280bhp... so where does the NSX cut it's time?
Are there any 02+ dyno printouts on here?

[NoelWatson]

Are there any 02+ dyno printouts on here?

I'm hopefully going to arrange something in the next few weeks.

[simonprelude]

Had a look back at photo's etc from the Dyno day we did and there were no facelift cars there.

Maybe this will change if we organise another one ??

[simonprelude]

Noel, have you started a thread in the meets section, perhaps we can drum up interest from some of the previous attendees to use as a comparison.


I'm hopefully going to arrange something in the next few weeks.

[markc]

You're correct Martin, one mag recorded a 10.9sec 0-100mph (can't find it right now) and indeed Car & Driver managed a 10.6 on the way to 150mph. Link to Prime article here...

http://www.nsxprime.com/FAQ/Media/magazines/cd9808.htm

No question about it though the game has moved on massively since the early/mid 90's and particularly so in the last few years.

Materials, electronically controlled mechanicals (g'boxs, diffs and dampers), brakes & ABS, aerodynamics, traction/stability control systems, tyres and especially ignition/fuelling are all hugely more sophisticated.

Just read the article on the new F430 Scuderia (and 911GT2) in this months evo as an example!

They're waaay faster, certainly in the hands of a non professional driver, for all this stuff but it seems to be generally accepted that the techno feast makes them less fun tho'... which is where the Elise, Caterham etc come in.

I guess one of each is the way forward :)

Mark

[NoelWatson]

Noel, have you started a thread in the meets section, perhaps we can drum up interest from some of the previous attendees to use as a comparison.

Simon - I've been a bit slack - will ring Surry Rolling Road now

[NoelWatson]

Simon - I've been a bit slack - will ring Surry Rolling Road now

http://nsxcb.co.uk/testvb/showthread.php?p=29705#post29705

[NoelWatson]

You're correct Martin, one mag recorded a 10.9sec 0-100mph (can't find it right now) and indeed Car & Driver managed a 10.6 on the way to 150mph. Link to Prime article here...

http://www.nsxprime.com/FAQ/Media/magazines/cd9808.htm

No question about it though the game has moved on massively since the early/mid 90's and particularly so in the last few years.

Materials, electronically controlled mechanicals (g'boxs, diffs and dampers), brakes & ABS, aerodynamics, traction/stability control systems, tyres and especially ignition/fuelling are all hugely more sophisticated.

Just read the article on the new F430 Scuderia (and 911GT2) in this months evo as an example!

They're waaay faster, certainly in the hands of a non professional driver, for all this stuff but it seems to be generally accepted that the techno feast makes them less fun tho'... which is where the Elise, Caterham etc come in.

I guess one of each is the way forward :)

Mark

Mark,

I read this bit

"The 911's 10 - second time from 140 to 150 mph was the longest of any car's in the test, and five seconds longer than the NSX's."

and thought the NSX had to be "optimised", but looking at my footage from Bruntingthorpe mine was getting from indicated) 140-160 in around 11 seconds (very roughly).

[Senninha]

Does anyone know when this years event is being run please?

MIght give this a go ....

Regards, Paul

[simonprelude]

Email Craig :)

http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&t=487103


Does anyone know when this years event is being run please?

MIght give this a go ....

Regards, Paul

[NoelWatson]

Does anyone know when this years event is being run please?

MIght give this a go ....

Regards, Paul

Paul,

Let me know if you decide to go as I may attempt to break 161mph

[TheQuietOne]

Me too...would be interesting to see if the Tubi has made any difference!