NA1- NSX-R Exaust & Alloys

[Sudesh]

Apart from myth lol, is there a difference [aside from color] in the NA1 NSX-R alloys? Some say they are lighter others say they are not? So what's the real truth?

Also is there any difference in the NA1 NSX-R exhaust from standard car?

I know the tips are different on NA1 NSX-R; the tips are part of the exhaust rather that "trims" that screw on like that standard NSX exhaust, but are there any other differences?

[NSXGB]

Always thought the same as yourself, the R alloys for the NA1 and NA2 were lighter.

[Sudesh]

Always thought the same as yourself, the R alloys for the NA1 and NA2 were lighter.

How much lighter and where are the specs?

[AR]

Sudesh the OEM NA1 R exhaust has the slash cut tips as on Euro cars and the Type S.

Cheers,

AR

[Sudesh]

Sudesh the OEM NA1 R exhaust has the slash cut tips as on Euro cars and the Type S.

Cheers,

AR

Hi Ary,

Yeah I know the tips are different, and edited my bad spelling on the first thread lol. But wondered are there any other differences?

[Sudesh]

NSX-R

http://i77.photobucket.com/albums/j77/icongroup/NSXPARTS/NA1-NSX-R.jpg

Standard

http://i77.photobucket.com/albums/j77/icongroup/NSXPARTS/13SL00_003_2-1.jpg

[NSXGB]

How much lighter and where are the specs?

Not sure about the NA1 R wheels but the NA2 R wheels are allegedly 2lb lighter each. Info taken from a US vendors site.

[AR]

Sudesh I could not find any diffrence excep that mine had the heatshield powder coated black.

[Sudesh]

Sudesh I could not find any diffrence excep that mine had the heatshield powder coated black.

Must have a look at the part numbers to see if they are different on the heat shield.

EDIT: Part numbers are the same Ary, so someome must have done that themselves.

[AR]

Must have a look at the part numbers to see if they are different on the heat shield.

EDIT: Part numbers are the same Ary, so someome must have done that themselves.

Sudesh I am pretty sure it was OEM, such low volume is bound to be discrepancies.

[Sudesh]

Sudesh I am pretty sure it was OEM, such low volume is bound to be discrepancies.

Yeah you could be right Ary! Done a bit more digging and found 3 part numbers now, and they are also listed on the UK parts system.

Listed for the NSX-R, BUT also on UK/Europe system is:
74650-SL0-000 £124.81 + vat

Also have: 74650-SL0-0010 £138.64 + vat and: 74650-SL0-A00 £124.81 + VAT

Was trying to look at some pics I have but hard to tell as I dont have any that really show that low down of the rear.

Maybe Mark could have a look at his Type-S and let me know.

[Sudesh]

Ary,

I think you are correct!

I found this pic of what looks like the facelift NSX-R and the heatshield is Black. So I would say the NA1 NSX-R is the same.

http://i77.photobucket.com/albums/j77/icongroup/NSXPARTS/PicFetch.jpg

[NSX 2000]

Ary,

I think you are correct!

I found this pic of what looks like the facelift NSX-R and the heatshield is Black. So I would say the NA1 NSX-R is the same.

http://i77.photobucket.com/albums/j77/icongroup/NSXPARTS/PicFetch.jpg

I must have an NSX-R then Sudesh

[Senninha]

http://i77.photobucket.com/albums/j77/icongroup/NSXPARTS/PicFetch.jpg

That looks just like the underside of my NSX apart from the cats and exhaust ..... :)

[Sudesh]

I must have an NSX-R then Sudesh

That would be a NO paul lol



From what I can gater from going through the UK/JDM and EU parts system, it would seem like Honda then installed the black heat shield to facelift NSX's as standard.

[markc]

Maybe Mark could have a look at his Type-S and let me know.

Missed this one...

Mine isn't black. I'd bet the NSX-R exhaust is the same as the regular cars (except for the tips style) i.e. quiet but not good for power.

As for the wheels, the original NSX-R came on 15/16 Enkie's so I don't think there's anything special or unique about them. The optional 16/17's look like regular NSX "Blades" and I very much doubt they're of differant construction, unless you count paint colour?

I have my doubt about NA2 NSX-R wheels as well, does anyone know for certain that they're really differant to regular >02 wheels... other than a differant colour?

Is there a theme here, paint it a differant colour so it has a differant p/n and call it unique to the R :)

At least the Type S/Zero wheels are properly unique ;)

Cheers

Mark

[m666 edd]

I do wonder about the wheels :)

Next time I get new tyres I'll try and remember to get them weighed. Aren't they supposed to be 2 pounds lighter per wheel?

[AR]

Something like that, but why oh why did they not give the NA2 facelifted cars at least 370 BHP, different car altogether.

[markc]

I do wonder about the wheels :)

Next time I get new tyres I'll try and remember to get them weighed. Aren't they supposed to be 2 pounds lighter per wheel?

Being a saddo, I just pulled out my 2003 JDM NSX-R (NA2) brochure and there's no mention of any weight saving for the wheels. NSXPrime claims an approx 1.6lbs saving per front wheel and 3.3lbs per rear but doesn't give a source... http://www.nsxprime.com/wiki/Wheel_Tech
IMHO if this were true Honda would have made more of a thing about it in the brochure, especially as they look identical and therefore the construction and/or material would have to be fairly special.

My 1997 JDM NSX (NA2) brochure claims a total saving of 4kgs in total for the 4x Type S/Zero BBS's. Prime claims 1.3lbs per front and 3lbs per rear. More plausible as they're a totally differant design.

Sounds like another NSX-R urban myth... lets see one on the TDI dyno ;)

Cheers

Mark

[AR]

In the end with the NA2R they seem to keep on ignoring the big Elephant in the room.


The car needs more power!

[markc]

In the end with the NA2R they seem to keep on ignoring the big Elephant in the room.

The car needs more power!

... and therefore bigger/better brakes.

Can't have one without the other or you'll unbalance the package.

[AR]

You got that right Mark!

[simonprelude]

Being a saddo, I just pulled out my 2003 JDM NSX-R (NA2) brochure and there's no mention of any weight saving for the wheels. NSXPrime claims an approx 1.6lbs saving per front wheel and 3.3lbs per rear but doesn't give a source... http://www.nsxprime.com/wiki/Wheel_Tech
IMHO if this were true Honda would have made more of a thing about it in the brochure, especially as they look identical and therefore the construction and/or material would have to be fairly special.

My 1997 JDM NSX (NA2) brochure claims a total saving of 4kgs in total for the 4x Type S/Zero BBS's. Prime claims 1.3lbs per front and 3lbs per rear. More plausible as they're a totally differant design.

Sounds like another NSX-R urban myth... lets see one on the TDI dyno ;)

Cheers

Mark

I was with Kevin when he collected the wheels, certainly seemed light weight to me however I've not felt the weight of the normal 17's so can't 100% compare.

[Kaz-kzukNA1]

Hi, all.

The weight of 02R wheel together with the specially designed tyre BS 070 is just about 1.0kg lighter than the standard 17in wheel+tyre fitted to the facelift models.

Although the appeance looks the same, the 02R wheel was shaved off at several places compared to the standard one.

Regards,
Kaz

[markc]

Hi, all.

The weight of 02R wheel together with the specially designed tyre BS 070 is just about 1.0kg lighter than the standard 17in wheel+tyre fitted to the facelift models.

Although the appeance looks the same, the 02R wheel was shaved off at several places compared to the standard one.

Regards,
Kaz

Thanks Kaz,

So is it the wheel/tyre combination that get quoted as weight saving or just the wheel/s?

A few lbs of metal (3lbs for a rear wheel) is a LOT of shaving from an individual wheel! I guess if they turned each wheel in a lathe and thinned down the entire inner rim that might do it?

It's great to get to the real information rather than the internet myths :)

Cheers

Mark

[Procar Specials]

I'd bet the NSX-R exhaust is the same as the regular cars (except for the tips style) i.e. quiet but not good for power.

The NSX-R NA1 which was in germany some years before for the Nordschleife lap time
was equipped with an standard looking exhaust, only the tips looked different
(2x90mm) But this car was loud.
Finally the original muffler was modified and the cats were removed.

Generally JDM NA1R exhaust is the same as NA1 exhaust, only different tips.


I have my doubt about NA2 NSX-R wheels as well, does anyone know for certain that they're really differant to regular >02 wheels... other than a differant colour?

The 02R rims
Manufacturer: BBS
Front rim weight 7.4 kg
Rear rim weight 8.4 kg

The standard 02+ rims
Manufacturer: ASAHI
Front rim weight 8.1 kg
Rear rim weight 9.1 kg

So the weight difference of the rims is 2.8 kg alone.

[markc]

The 02R rims
Manufacturer: BBS
Front rim weight 7.4 kg
Rear rim weight 8.4 kg

The standard 02+ rims
Manufacturer: ASAHI
Front rim weight 8.1 kg
Rear rim weight 9.1 kg

So the weight difference of the rims is 2.8 kg alone.

Excellent, deffinative information :) For the sake of completeness do you know how this was achieved? Differant alloy? Differant mould making a thinner structure? Both are forged construction I believe.

I wonder a) why the brochure doesn't state this? and b) why they kept the same look/style?

Thanks again

Mark

[AR]

The 02 plus wheels I had said BBS forged, as far as I was concern Asahi made the cast copies as sold by macs and others in Japan. The exhaust on my NA1R had a black heatshield.

Cheers,

AR

[markc]

The 02 plus wheels I had said BBS forged, as far as I was concern Asahi made the cast copies as sold by macs and others in Japan. The exhaust on my NA1R had a black heatshield.

Cheers,

AR

So still some room for clarification then.

Can some of the 02+ owners chip in and confirm if their wheels are made by BBS or Asahi?

Cheers

Mark

[NSXGB]

Bbs.......

[AR]

Mark, I was going by OEM ones I had. i think Detlef is wrong on this one.

[Senninha]

So still some room for clarification then.

Can some of the 02+ owners chip in and confirm if their wheels are made by BBS or Asahi?

Cheers

Mark

As Simon says .. BBS.

I'm sure I also read that the offset or rerar wheel width differed to enhance handling. As for wieght I'm of the understanding that it is the combined wheel/tyre that delivers the benefit, not the wheel alone.

The debate continues....

regards, Paul

[NSX 2000]

So still some room for clarification then.

Can some of the 02+ owners chip in and confirm if their wheels are made by BBS or Asahi?

Cheers

Mark

I'll let you know when I get the new ones some time in 2010;)

Plus I will weigh them with out tyres so we can confirm weights quoted

[markc]

As Simon says .. BBS.

The evidence (so far) seems to be that BBS made all the genuine 02+ wheels.


I'm sure I also read that the offset or rerar wheel width differed to enhance handling.

Never heard that before Paul, could be (yet) another NSX-R myth?


As for wieght I'm of the understanding that it is the combined wheel/tyre that delivers the benefit, not the wheel alone.

Kaz said the NSX-R wheels are "shaved off" in several places. I suspect this will save less weight than the white paint they then apply ;)

I'm sure you can buy lighter tyres than the RE070's as well if you look around.


The debate continues....

Indeed... but there shouldn't be anything to debate as such, pedant that I am I'm trying to determine the facts.

Cheers

Mark

[simonprelude]

I thought Kevin said the R ones were magnesium ??

[Kaz-kzukNA1]

So still some room for clarification then.

Can some of the 02+ owners chip in and confirm if their wheels are made by BBS or Asahi?

Cheers

Mark
For your reference, I can confirm that the alloy wheel for standard 02+ and 02-R was manufactured by a company called Washi Beam Co., Ltd. based in Japan. It has joint capital relationship with BBS and the sales were handled by their group company BBS Japan. Thus, the stamp mark of ‘BBS’ on the wheel.
Washi Beam is also the manufacture and supplier of the magnesium forged wheel for many racing categories including F1.

Regards,
Kaz

[markc]

I thought Kevin said the R ones were magnesium ??

Ha ha, yet another myth :)


For your reference, I can confirm that the alloy wheel for standard 02+ and 02-R was manufactured by a company called Washi Beam Co., Ltd. based in Japan. It has joint capital relationship with BBS and the sales were handled by their group company BBS Japan. Thus, the stamp mark of ‘BBS’ on the wheel.
Washi Beam is also the manufacture and supplier of the magnesium forged wheel for many racing categories including F1.

Regards,
Kaz

Thank you Kaz.

So, the 02R wheel is essentially the same as the standard 02 wheel except its "shaved" and usually, but not always, painted white. Any weight saving claimed is primarily down to the differance between the standard fit tyres and RE070's fitted to the 02R.

Excellent.. all myths Busted :)

Washi Beam Co Ltd ehh is that why my wheels are Washi Grey :)

Mark